******* creationists!

DC keeps asking questions about how humans evolved… ze knows there were dinosaurs and they died out, and now there are humans, and the mammals during dinosaur time were small, but how did there get to be humans?

Did you know that none of the museums in the city nearest ours have an early humans exhibit?  From the webpage it looks like the museum in the next nearest city also do not have such an exhibit.

We’re all going to (Washington) DC this year just so we can find a museum with an early humans exhibit!  (Also there’s a conference.  Ah, conference vacations, without you we would never leave town.)

But DC still keeps asking, so I thought…well, we’ve got LOTS of science books.  Why don’t we have one for human evolution?  Hm, Scholastic (see:  Scholastic addiction) has lots of science books, but I haven’t seen any on early humans.  I wonder why that is.

Wait, I thought… Maybe the fact that the museums in this specific region of the country are conspicuously missing exhibits on early humans is related to the fact that Scholastic doesn’t sell any books on say, evolution.

Maybe there’s a large purchasing demographic they want to keep buying/donating/visiting.

DH says:   There’s just some people you don’t want to tick off.  Would you want to upset anarchists? Well…

Well, that kind of sucks.  Dratted creationists and their dratted market power.  No wonder folks don’t believe in evolution– there’s a feedback loop.

That’s my rant.  Are there things you miss because of where you’re living?  Do groups with large amounts of purchasing power ever mess you up?

83 Responses to “******* creationists!”

  1. Everyday Tips Says:

    This comment will be a ramble….
    For, for clarification, when you mention ‘early humans’, are you referring to “Lucy” and such? Or, to times prior?

    I just quickly looked at Amazon and there is a book called “Tree of Life: The Wonders of Evolution”. I chuckled because the review reads as follows: “Given the limited number of picture books about evolution for young children, the book does a fine job of filling that niche. Recommended.” — SWON Libraries, February 2009 (SouthWest Ohio and Neighboring Libraries “As a rare, scientifically accurate, clearly explained book on evolution for young children, this book is welcomed…as a whole this book captures the excitement and sweep of Darwin’s great theory in an easy-to-read, fun style.” — The Children’s Examiner, February 16, 2009 (in feature article; 10 Books Beyond Belief: A Freethinking Foundation For Your Kids.) –This text refers to the Paperback edition.”

    Obviously this book was ‘created’ with you in mind!

    I can TOTALLY see why scholastic doesn’t touch this with a million foot pole. I am sure a certain percentage of business is from the home-schooling community, whom often tend more toward creationist theory. If they even suggested evolution as a possibility, the risk of backlash is probably far greater than the possibility of the company making huge profits off of a book(s) on evolution.

    Good luck on your quest!!

  2. Practical Parsimony Says:

    In the education dept of a large university, the head of the science dept is a creationist. So, he is instructing future teachers! He counted one point off on a paper, giving me a 99. When I asked him why he circled the word “acquisitive” and counted off the point, he said, “Because I did not know what it meant.”

    He had ranted on and on all the time about people who did not keep up with the computer age, and here he was, a PhD not willing to either pick up the dictionary, use the internet, or just look at the word, the root and suffix and figure it out himself. Oh, he hated me so that played a large part in giving me a 99 on a 100 paper. That is my creationist story! They are very intolerant of many things, not just about creation.

    Having access to my records, he obviously had found that I had a degree in Women’s Studies. That is a no-no, too, obviously. So, he made my life miserable. Unlike the really young students, I was not afraid of challenging him on really stupid things or things I was not willing to do (he demanded people come straight from work, prepared to go sit in the hall with crayons and pretend we were little kids!). Aaack

  3. Practical Parsimony Says:

    I meant to say they are intolerant of many things, not just evolution.

  4. Adam Says:

    I love this. “Did you know that none of the museums in the city nearest ours have an early humans exhibit? From the webpage it looks like the museum in the next nearest city also do not have such an exhibit.”

    Here’s an idea! Step up and lead. Get involved with your local museum. Help raise money to start an early humans exhibit. If it’s important enough to you to help enlighten others, then step up and get it done.

    • nicoleandmaggie Says:

      Riiiiight, step up and get involved in my local museum which is 2 hours away that we visit once a year. Given that this is a large city and a large museum, I have a funny feeling that no amount of effort that I could do would add an evolution exhibit. We would probably also get death threats.

      And who said anything about enlightening others? I am sure creationists want my “religious beliefs” pushed on them about the same amount as I want theirs pushed on me.

  5. hush Says:

    Are there things I miss because of where I’m living, you ask? Yes. I miss having full reproductive freedom: if I ever needed to terminate a pregnancy, I could not do so lawfully within 3 hours of where I live. However, I could get a free prenatal ultrasound and a picture to keep.

    I miss being in a place where there’s fluoride in the water, where most people vaccinate their kids, and would never dream of homeschooling.

    • nicoleandmaggie Says:

      OMG. YES. We must live near each other. Or in the same blood red swath. I’m actually not sure if the u/s legislation passed in this state, but it has definitely been talked about. And actually, that required u/s is probably not free, I’m pretty sure you would have to pay for it.

      And if I were to agitate about something that would cause me to get death threats it would definitely be abortion rights over an evolution exhibit at the local museum. And here’s a link to your post since you didn’t link it. http://husheveryone.blogspot.com/2011/06/divorce-always-shocks-me-plus-running.html

    • Cloud Says:

      I get what you’re saying.

      But sadly, I think some of these things are more widespread than you’d think at first glance. Here in San Diego, we’ve only recently gotten fluoride in our water and there are still a vocal minority of people who are sure it is a government plot to… what? I’m not sure. Also, there is a big contingent of crunchy, “all natural” parents who won’t vaccinate, so we had a measles outbreak when Pumpkin was not quite one. And the homeschooling, OMG, the homeschooling… I don’t get that phenomenon at all, but it is here, too.

      But interestingly, I was going to answer the question with “good deep dish pizza”, because I’ve yet to find a place in San Diego that can really do that. I don’t think the fact that my initial answer was so shallow says anything good about me….

      Also- Nicoleandmaggie, I grew up in a place where they didn’t teach evolution. Just skipped it. I didn’t get introduced to the theory properly until college. So don’t despair- you’ll be frustrated, but your kid will be fine!

      • nicoleandmaggie Says:

        I believe the gov’t fluoride plot is to pollute our precious bodily fluids…

        Oh, Cloud, we love you. We too miss good deep dish pizza.

        re: homeschooling: I have some sympathy for it given how awful public schools can be.

      • Cloud Says:

        Oh, I’m sympathetic to homeschooling when it is addressing an actual problem. Heck, I’m even sympathetic to my cousin whose wife is homeschooling their kids because even the private Catholic schools in his area aren’t pure enough for him. But I’ve run into a bunch of homeschoolers recently whose kids could actually go to pretty good public schools, and are not in any group that you’d expect to have problems in regular school- I grumpily and perhaps unfairly think that in those cases the stay at home parent is just looking for a reason not to go back to work. Which is fine, I suppose, and none of my business… but I just don’t get it. Why not send the kids to school and volunteer somewhere? Again, none of my business. I’m sure it will all work out fine, but when I talk to someone like that I feel like I’m having a conversation across a great cultural divide!

      • nicoleandmaggie Says:

        “the stay at home parent is just looking for a reason not to go back to work”
        and the stay-at-home parent perhaps has a JD? or some other job that sucked, but rather than admit that they say that their delicate children (who you personally think would be WAY better behaved in a school setting) need them?

        I blame the patriarchy. Yes, volunteering would be a MUCH better way to go, and in the past that’s probably what these ladies would have done. But DH isn’t working 80 hour weeks to make up for her lost income and failing to see his kids more than once a week to support a volunteer position.

        (Yes, I’m a bit judgmental too.)

    • Everyday Tips Says:

      There are so many things I want to say in response to all these comments, but I refrain.

      I will just say this. I know people that quit their jobs to homeschool, even though they lived in a great school district. Why sit back and waste time judging other people’s decisions? Unless you live in their house and raise their kids, you have no idea what struggles people may be experiencing. Just like I can’t understand how people think the world is only 6000 years old or whatever, I don’t care that they believe that and live according to bibilical teachings. (or their interpretation of such teachings).

      I was a stay at home mom for many years, and I was not bored, and I didn’t just babble about my kids all day to anyone that would listen. However, that is the general perception of SAHMs.

      I have to stop typing now.

      • Everyday Tips Says:

        By the way, this line doesn’t sound very sympathetic: “even the private Catholic schools in his area aren’t pure enough for him.” It sounds quite judgmental actually. You make many, many assumptions about other people.

        There are many reasons people do not go back to work, and it would be a hell of a lot easier to volunteer or find a part time job than to take on home schooling. Why would anyone need to make up an excuse to not go back to work? Is raising children not ‘work’, even if they are at school for 7 hours a day? Do kids not have vacations, sick days, field trips, doctor appts or other things that a parent may actually have to deal with?

        OK, I am really done now.

      • nicoleandmaggie Says:

        You’re going to love tomorrow’s post about one of our Catholic uncles and his wife…

        Notre Dame isn’t Catholic enough for him. His words.

      • nicoleandmaggie Says:

        I’m talking about some specific moms that I know and their specific circumstances. These are type A moms whose kids would be far better off (less aggressive, less neurotic) if they would just back off and stop overanalyzing. Stop going to those 8 hour weekend parenting classes on unparenting. If they would just accept that they don’t have to be martyrs in order to not go back to that law office job.

        Most of the folks I know who homeschool do so because they have religious beliefs or because it truly is better for their special-needs kids. Many of the SAHM I know are perfectly well-adjusted, they get out and talk to adults, they have hobbies… but these folks have much more laid-back personalities in general. (I do wish many of them would stop trying to sell me candles/jewelry/insurance/passion parties/discovery toys, but what can you do?)

      • Cloud Says:

        Sorry, @Everyday Tips, I didn’t mean to offend. I really am sympathetic to my cousin and his wife and don’t care if they homeschool. I don’t UNDERSTAND, but that is different from actually caring enough to judge their decision. And he has said almost exactly that line himself- the Catholic schools in his area are not a pure enough brand of Catholicism for him. How is it judgmental when I repeat his reason?

        I’m sorry if me not understanding sounds like me judging to you. I’m not- I truly mean it when I say that it is none of my business. But I really don’t understand it. Can I say that?

        And I don’t think SAHMs are bored. I never said that. I said I didn’t understand the mindset of someone who would opt for homeschooling when their public school option seems good and their kids seem like a good fit for a regular school. I don’t, and anytime I try to ask why they are homeschooling I just get “because it is better for the kids” with no real explanation. Like I said, it feels like a giant cultural divide.

      • nicoleandmaggie Says:

        When someone’s kid who is old enough to know better tries to brain my kid, unprovoked, with a large metal toolbox and the mom doesn’t discipline because the “Non violent parenting” class she takes tells her not to because it might hurt his feelings since he’s so delicate (as she explains, and that’s why it is so important that she not return to her law office job, even though she was making so much money and still has a lot of school debt, though she never gets to see her husband and when they do see each other, they fight etc…. I just met you why are you telling me your life story, can’t you see I’m from the midwest?…), I judge.

        I’m not as good a person as Cloud in that respect.

      • Everyday Tips Says:

        No worries Cloud, all is good. I am probably just oversensitive because when I was strictly a SAHM, I got a lot of flak and such from people wondering why I was wasting my education and other such things. Not to mention, I am tired!

      • Cloud Says:

        Well, no one’s tried to brain my kid yet, so it isn’t a fair comparison.

      • nicoleandmaggie Says:

        Natural parenting groups can be scary places.

    • Funny about Money Says:

      Makes my head ache. We can still get abortions here, but the teapartying legislators are doing their damnedest to bring a stop to that. Next thing you know, women won’t be allowed to drive, either.

      Fortunately we’re only an hour from the Mexican border. I’m sure the sons and daughters of the out-of-work back-alley abortionists await a new influx of American women with unexpected and unwelcome pregnancies.

      Now as for homeschooling: Our state’s schools are bottom-most or third from the bottom among U.S. K-12 schools ranked by quality. That means they are VERY, incredibly bad. I have adult students in my college courses who are not tea-partying fundamentalist nut cases and who do home-school, first in an effort to try to engineer decent education for their kids (and no joke–they CAN do better at this than the products of our colleges of education), and second, out of concern for their children’s physical safety. If I were a young woman today living in this place, I would probably elect to home-school if it were even remotely possible, and I’d be willing to make financial and lifestyle sacrifices to make it happen. More likely, though, I probably just wouldn’t have kids.

  6. Linda Says:

    “Are there things you miss because of where you’re living?” Yes. I’d love to be able to grow/acquire fresh, locally grown food all year ’round. Midwest winters make that impossible for me. Guess I’ll have to move to California.

    “Do groups with large amounts of purchasing power ever mess you up?” As I searched high and low for a pair of non-sporty sandals with adequate arch support last week, I came to the conclusion that I must the only person on the planet that wants something like this. Or maybe it’s just that the majority of females don’t want sandals like that. I wish I could get away with wearing my Keen H2s at work every day. Blech.

    • nicoleandmaggie Says:

      I noticed even the NAOT models in stores this year are pretty non-supportive. They’re all flip-flops!

      My quest for a pair of comfy professional black sandals continues.

    • Cloud Says:

      Have you seen Title Nine? They often have shoes that might meet your needs… Also good swimsuits and sports bras. But that’s another rant.

      • Linda Says:

        l just checked the website for Title Nine and didn’t see any (non-sport) sandals with arch support. They do have some good looking sports bras and once I lose a bit more weight (and I’m small enough to fit in one of those sizes) I may order one from them.

        I think the best I can find to meet my needs is these Naots from Zappos: http://www.zappos.com/naot-footwear-paris-toffee-leather

        They don’t have as much arch support as my H2s (I know because I’ve ordered, received, and tried them on), but they have *something* and I’m hoping they will be good enough to not cause me too much foot pain. The frugal part of me freaks out at spending that much a pair of sandals, though. Sheesh!

        This one of those trade-offs I guess: get paid more money but must maintain a separate “work wardrobe” at extra cost OR look for a job that allows me to dress more casually and likely earn less money. Hmmmm…

      • nicoleandmaggie Says:

        I think you can put stuff under the footbed of Naots to provide more support.

        Mine are similar to these: http://www.zappos.com/naot-footwear-lappland but not quite the same.

  7. Adam Says:

    Thanks for sharing the Wikipedia link, but there’s a better argument that excuses are much more expensive in the long run. We are an imperfect culture, no doubt, and probably never will become a utopia. However, people from all over the planet still clamor to live here, and the reason is simply because there are still those who have the fortitude to stand tall and make a positive difference. It’s always easier to complain.

    • nicoleandmaggie Says:

      You sure say a lot of things that don’t actually mean anything. Also: Vegetables are good for you. So is exercise. Spend less than you earn. Get enough sleep.

      Besides, if you look in the post, it already includes our solution to the problem we were complaining about. We’re going to DC. See the link? Smithsonian museum?

      • Adam Says:

        I read it. You’re going to the national museum to see the exhibit. I still don’t understand why you also choose to complain that your local museum does not have an exhibit, rather than provide some leadership for positive change. Enjoy the trip.

      • nicoleandmaggie Says:

        *You* think that it be positive change. Folks around here would strongly disagree.

        So you think nobody should be allowed to complain about anything unless they’re willing to drop everything: job, family, security, etc. to try to make (probably futile) widespread change that isn’t wanted by the majority of the community? Really?

  8. Adam Says:

    To answer your question directly, of course people should be allowed to complain about anything they want, at anytime. I just don’t see where complaining, without some positive follow-up action makes any difference. I’m also having a difficult time accepting that the situation is quite as draconian as you describe. I’d advise that any positive momentum always starts with an idea, then build support for it, and move forward. You can do this, and don’t need to drop everything else in the process.

    • Funny about Money Says:

      Trust me, Adam: it is. It’s even worse than it was when my son was a little kid, which is probably about as long ago as when you were born.

      And if you have time, around your job and raising kids and doing research and writing books to earn tenure, to go out and get funding for and mount a museum exhibit, bully for you. Let’s see YOU do it. ;-)

      To criticize someone for pointing out that something’s rotten in Denmark because they’re not up on a bulldozer blading up the garbage is effectively the same as saying “shut the f*** up; you have no right to speak.”

    • Leah Says:

      Adam, I don’t know where you live, nor where the authors live. But I live in Minnesota, and I will say that the circumstances are not draconian but they’re not all rainbows either. I teach biology. When I teach college classes, we teach evolution, and I haven’t gotten too much crap about it. But when I teach other grades (especially at nature centers), the “e-word” is forbidden. We often refer to adaptation, but we can’t talk about species changing and diverging. Adaptation must be taught in a loose way that allows people to think “oh, god made all these birds with different beaks.”

      In my case, trying to change the situation just means teaching about adaptation. If we tried to directly address evolution, people would simply stop coming to the programs I teach. This means lost revenue. It’s no good trying to change beliefs if it means people will shut down. I have found that the best method is to plant the ideas behind evolution (predator/prey, adaptation, survivorship, reproduction sometimes, etc) and then hope that some kids remember and have a more open mind when and if they get to college.

  9. Debbie M Says:

    “Are there things you miss because of where you’re living?” Not many. I’ve lived in a lot of places and I got to pick my favorite one to live in. So I get Tex-Mex food, which I really missed in Boston (in the early ’80s–they have some now). I get ice cream. I get loads of wildflowers in spring and summer. I get the best ballroom dance instructor ever and a good place to dance most weeks. I get people who aren’t too afraid to get out of the closet (sadly, still a little afraid). I get friends who like to think. Friends who like to walk. I get a huge college library. Actually I have all kinds of easy access to fabulous books, music, movies, and TV shows. I get access to organic and whole grain foods, even at a couple of restaurants. I get to dress casually everywhere. I get to be myself instead of have to change myself to fit in. (Well, I do try to change myself in good ways, but I don’t have to try to change myself in icky ways.)

    I do miss fabulous bike lanes (which I saw in Amsterdam) and having awesome mass transit (like everywhere I’ve been in Europe) and having lots of things in easy walking distance.

    “Do groups with large amounts of purchasing power ever mess you up?” You know, I’ve mostly noticed groups with large amounts of purchasing power helping me. Those baby boomers mean that more diseases will have cures by the time I get the diseases. People who refuse to park very far from the conference center mean that I get to park for FREE (instead of for $12) by parking only one mile away. Those people willing to spend lots of money on organic foods have made it so that i can find and afford to do so as well. Everyone wanting to go to the movies on Friday and Saturday night means that I can go more cheaply on Saturday and Sunday morning (and always get into the first show even of a very popular movie during the first weekend).

    Admittedly, although my city is good, I live in a state with so much purchasing power that the textbooks stink, and so I would be tempted to homeschool if I had kids and could afford to. Depending on how my kids and I got along, I would love, love, love teaching them (and me), not only out of books but with lots of projects and field trips. And movies. And songs.

    • nicoleandmaggie Says:

      Boston has like one place in Inman square that has decent Mexican. Other than that even the best is mediocre.

      I miss public transit too!!! And sidewalks!

      Our textbooks are also … creative… they follow the TX standards (we’re more of a CA standards family).

      • Debbie M Says:

        Oh, sidewalks. I love sidewalks, too. We mostly have them, at least on one side of the street, except in the low-traffic housing areas where we mostly don’t need them (though they just put some in on one of the streets where I go jogging and I love it). In Atlanta, when I was walking somewhere, I once actually had a driver yell out the window at me that I should get a car. In a Dallas suburb, strangers would pull over to offer me a ride. Where I live now, it’s still mostly dog walkers and the homeless who walk, but there are also a few other people.

        I heard Boston now had both fast food Mexican (Taco Bell) and sit-down (On the Border). I admit I’ve never been to On the Border, but I do like Taco Bell (I know, it’s not very good, but I grew up with it). When I was in Boston, I found one place in Faneuil Hall where I ordered a taco and a burrito which both turned out to be burritos (maybe one had meat and the other had beans?), and my friend from Connecticut had never heard of a burrito.

        Texas “standards”? Interesting word choice.

      • nicoleandmaggie Says:

        On the Border is a mediocre chain.
        You have to drive pretty far to get to a Taco Bell in Boston and they generally share a building/counter with KFC or Pizza Hut. The place in Faneuil Hall you’re talking about is Baja Fresh– it’s a CA chain that was awesome until it got bought out by McDonald’s.

        Another thing I miss about Boston is awesome Indian food.

        Don’t laugh– Standards is the technical jargon word! What’s in textbooks across the country is determined by CA, TX, and maybe a third state (though I’m not sure… maybe NY? Though I would think NY would just use CA textbooks).

  10. bogart Says:

    I thought I actually *was* DebbieM until I saw the part about Taco Bell. Disclaimer: I have never actually eaten in a Taco Bell (Really. And I’ve lived in the US basically my entire life, and we have plenty of Taco Bells around us.). But, setting aside that awkward Taco Bell angle, DebbieM’s post largely captures my response to your question (we do have decent Mexican-ish food around here, thanks in part to a population that’s ~10% first-generation Mexican, etc., emigrants — though a local/native-Mexican grad student I used to know told me that actually, not so much (the food, not the migration). But, good enough for me, and locally owned and operated — not chains (mostly)).

    It would be nice to live in a nation that whose citizenry had something approximating reasonable access to health care (and dental care).

    Purchasing power: not so much, I don’t think. Except that OMG I bought *so* many baby carriers/slings and never found one that met my standards. Good grief! If I ever again read one more testimonial about how “I love it so much! I can ever wear it to vacuum!” I may shriek (fortunately DS is now past the reasonably portable stage, so no need to cover your ears). I was earnestly tempted to invent the sport of “extreme baby-wearing” just so that we could get something that was, you know, useful (the sport would start with a team of adults with an infant and you’d have to feed hir while in the carrier, cross rough terrain, do transfers from adult-to-adult to demonstrate the ease-of-attaching/removing baby/carrier, get on/off public transport (including sitting down and standing/strap-hanging poses), tie your shoes (while carrying) and untangle two large (but friendly) mutts’ intertwined leashes. When you finished the course, the former infant would be 3 years old, and your dissertation — or tenure file — would be complete.). But what can I say — I took a nap instead.

    • nicoleandmaggie Says:

      we favor zolowear
      http://www.zolowear.com … We both had ring slings, one came as a gift and we liked it so much we got a larger one for DH. dc figured out pretty early how to eat in mine, much to my surprise, rough terrain only when ze was old enough to do the side carry… adult-to-adult transfers no problem, public transport and airports, no problem, tying shoes involved squatting (just like being pregnant again!), tangled leashes no problem… A very high quality simple sling. And yes, I even washed dishes wearing it (DH wore it to vacuum).

      • Linda Says:

        I took a trip to Zambia in 1996 and recall seeing mothers carrying their babies in slings that they devised from single piece of cloth. They seemed to get around just fine like that. Maybe there should be a class for new parents where they get taught that nifty trick!

      • nicoleandmaggie Says:

        There are! I never did figure out the maya wrap. But the ring sling worked great.

    • Debbie M Says:

      I totally want to watch some Extreme Baby Wearing!

  11. bogart Says:

    LOL, OK, we better get on different teams for the whole babywearing relay thing, then. Yeah, I didn’t like ring slings at all. My 2 favorites ended up being a Mai Tei when DS was quite small (points off, though, for ease of attaching and likelihood of detaching without waking sleeping baby) and a no-ring sling (peanutshell, specifically) once he got bigger. It’s amazing how personal that stuff is.

    If only MountainSmith would design baby carriers. Clearly I’m still scarred …

    • nicoleandmaggie Says:

      If you haven’t given zolowear a chance– it is truly the apex of the ring sling. Padded, comes with an instruction video so you’re sure to wear it correctly (not placing the ring in the right place leads to problems), nice long tail… much nicer than other ring slings I’ve tried from other folks.

      • bogart Says:

        OK, but the kid now weighs 38# and I am not, in fact, going to sling him anymore. Maybe if blessed with (step)grandchildren I’ll explore, but honestly, I (a) found the tail to be among the more annoying aspects of a ring sling (thus my delight in discovering the peanutshell type) and (b) prefer something I can stash in a purse that won’t get tangled.

        I suppose the real answer is to have a babywearing store with a diverse array of carriers on every corner, so we can at least find what we like.

      • nicoleandmaggie Says:

        Right right, but your hypothetical kid in the hypothetical sling.

        I actually used the sling as a purse– it comes with a zippered pocket. :)

      • Cloud Says:

        @bogart, I had such a store (the breastfeeding shop at the hospital where I gave birth) and I still struggled with carriers. With baby #1, the problem was that she hated to be worn until she was old enough to face out. Given her personality now, that makes perfect sense. But at the time, it stressed me out. Why is my baby screaming when I put her in this thing? What am I doing wrong???

        For baby #2, I had a Moby for when she was really little, the ring sling baby #1 spurned for when she was older, and the Bjorn that was the only thing my husband would use. But I was never really happy with any of them. I wondered if the Ergo would work, but now she is too big (and wanting to be like her big sister!) to use any of them, so I’ve given up the quest.

      • nicoleandmaggie Says:

        I know a ton of people who swear by Ergos. When DC was small, they didn’t have the infant insert yet, so we never got one.

        There are a bunch of different holds for the ring sling. Some work better than others, and I don’t think we would have been able to use it at all without the instructional dvd that came with the zolowear.

      • bogart Says:

        LOL. Yes, well, I’m the one who — hypothetically — raised the topic. @NicoleandMaggie, too funny; I don’t carry a purse (except when I need it, e.g. for a diaper bag). @Cloud, we actually had such a store too though in retrospect it was pretty limited (I’d say Ergo, Maya, Moby and maybe a couple others), and the “good” carriers are absurdly expensive, new (leading me to buy untested models, inexpensive, over ebay and then — often — regret it, though this is also how I found my “good” carriers). I did use a Beco (similar to Ergo) some, but among my (clearly numerous!) pet peeves is the near-insistence so many makers — including Ergo and Beco — have on (a) 100% cotton and (b) heavy padding. I want something slick (really) and not padded since IMO (a) makes it easier to position the kid, and the carrier on you and (b) once squished the padding does little anyway — and unsquished, it just makes it hard to stuff the thing into my purse. I do see Zolowear comes in silk (though, sigh, brocade — not as slippery as plain…), but I wish babywear makers weren’t so leery of synthetics. I see from your don’t-lean-back post that your younger is 20 months and it was at about that stage that I stuffed mine (admittedly scrawny) into a peanutshell sling for some international travel and then kept him in it (not continuously) for much of that winter (one downside to the snug not-adjustable slings: I needed a different size to wear over my winter versus my summer clothing). So what constitutes too big is another YMMV, though we didn’t have the “wanting to be like a big sib” issue to deal with.

      • nicoleandmaggie Says:

        If it were too slippery, the ring would probably slip. And yeah, they are pretty expensive. It was a very nice gift! The only padding is at the shoulder, which is a good place for it.

        They also have a mesh version that folds up really small. I haven’t tried it, but we got one for a friend who complains about overheating.

      • bogart Says:

        Yeah, I did see the mesh, looks like those aren’t currently in stock, but an interesting idea.

        Maybe I should quit the day job (not!) and start engineering babywearing products.

      • nicoleandmaggie Says:

        haha! help the world!

  12. Grace Says:

    I don’t know how we got from creationism to baby slings.

    But back to creationism–it is galling to me that any public school supported by MY tax dollars would even mention creationism. That’s RELIGION. That’s certainly NOT SCIENCE. It’s a sad, sad statement on the political interference with education that we even have to talk about this.

  13. Squirrelers Says:

    Wow, what a set of comments here! Interesting discussions….

    Well, to get back to your question of “Are there things you miss because of where you’re living?”, I would say not very much, at least in the context by which you seem to be asking. Living here in the Chicago area, things seem to fit with my general way of thinking, and besides, it’s so diverse here that one can find what they’re looking for if they look hard enough.

    Out of context, sure there are things I’m missing being here – namely, better weather and less driving!

    Side note – it’s interesting how the might dollar shows it’s influence in many ways. The book example you give is a typical one.

  14. Spanish Prof Says:

    Don’t get me started. But where I am spending the week (see my cryptic post) is 20 miles away from a museum related to the topic of your post., and I am tempted to go, if the hours fit.

  15. Jacq @ Single Mom Rich Mom Says:

    Canada is awesome and there’s very little I would change. Except the prices, but I guess that’s ok. Even the taxes are okay. We get a good society out of it. We do have Quebec, which has little purchasing power, but much political power. There’s a few things I would change there, but overall it’s much better than it was 20 years ago, so that’s fine.
    I don’t think Scholastic up here sells creationism materials either (but honestly I’ve never noticed since it’s not up for debate), so maybe it’s just not their deal.
    We do have one of the best paleontology museums in the world up here close to me:

  16. nicoleandmaggie Says:

    Join us tomorrow for an incredibly judgmental post about a couple of Catholic relatives! But I think you’ll forgive us. (That would, of course, be the Catholic thing to do…)

    Note: any link-bait posts saying something like, “I wouldn’t go into debt” will be summarily deleted.

  17. Sandy H Says:

    I had never thought about this. It hasn’t come up with my kids yet, but I find it oddly troubling.

  18. Funny about Money Says:

    It’s amazing to see that things haven’t changed since my son was a little boy. When he was about six or seven, he came home from the expensive private Episcopal day school we were sending him to (because the public schools here were not an option) and told me that if a person got sick, all he had to do was pray and God would make him all well. {sigh} About then I began to realize that even though the school was better academically than the public schools in our vicinity, he was learning precious little science.

    Soooo…. After I explained to him the results that coalesced after his great-grandmother, a Christian Scientist, prayed to recover from the cancer that killed her, I thot it would be good to get him some kid-centric books describing evolution, like the ones I had when I was his age, the ones that first made me passionate about science. Does anyone remember the Big Golden Book of Science? Probably not. Presumably all the copies have been burned in some bonfire by now.

    Well, there were no Big Golden Books of much of anything anymore. Nor could I find One. Single. Grade-School Level Book that even touched on the subject of human evolution. Anywhere. I tried to mail-order something through the local stores (Amazon didn’t exist at the time), and that’s when I learned that literally there was nothing to be had.

    Today you can find a few choices on Amazon. Interestingly, the prices are in pounds sterling…that could be because when you google the topic in connection with “children’s books,” Amazon.co.UK comes up.

  19. Consumption value of chores? « Grumpy rumblings of the half-tenured Says:

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